Unpack the Fear of Connecting

Anita Brick: Hi, this is Anita Brick and welcome to CareerCast at Chicago Booth. To help you advance in your career, today, we're delighted to be speaking with Gloria Petersen. She's the founder and president of Global Protocol Inc., a protocol expert and author of The Art of Professional Connections, a four guidebook series with subject matter expert companion training modules. Over the last 30 years, her clients range from Fortune 100 companies to emerging entrepreneurs. Gloria hosted the Fox Television series Image of Success and has been sharing her expert advice on numerous radio and television shows. You're quite prolific in your writing and in your speaking, and so thank you for carving a little bit of time out for us today at Chicago Booth. Gloria Petersen: My pleasure.

Anita Brick: There's a lot of interest around connecting. Let's start with a student question and he said, "I know that everyone goes through this, and yet I hesitate networking because I know that I hate to be rejected or even worse, be ignored. Any advice appreciated."

Gloria Petersen: Well, first of all, I think too many people are relying on social media for their conversation, if you will. They're interacting so much with their texting and their social media that when they do get out into the real world and have a real conversation that's face to face, it can be mind-boggling. Certainly, I'm guilty of this just as well and I've evolved, and that's the whole idea of this whole thing. It's possible that you're putting too much attention on your discomfort and making assumptions. It's a mindset game, it really is. Focus on what you can gather from a conversation, what you can learn. Everyone has something interesting to add, you just have to listen for it. It's getting beyond your own discomfort and not making these assumptions.

Anita Brick: Going along with that, this student has a bit more experience and he said, "What's the best way to approach an individual you want to talk to, ultimately maybe help you, when you don't really know the person well?"

Gloria Petersen: When you walk into a room and you actually see somebody you want to approach and you want to have a conversation with them, walk with that sense of direction, that purpose, that sense of purpose towards that individual or group and then simply say, "Excuse me," that was a nice, kind, powerful words that gets their attention. Next, introduce yourself, "My name is," and then with that, say, "And you are?" Don't just stop with your name and drop the ball there, and then, "You are?" And the fun part of this is when they say their name back, ask for the last name. Typically, people will only offer their first name, but your identity is composed of a first and a last name. I say that oftentimes when the last name does come, it's challenging. It might be awkward because it's different. It has a different phonic sound to it than what you're used to. Try to repeat their name. I've done this and I didn't even worry about the conversation because I started to get a lesson on the pronunciation of the name. I would get a history of their life because you're bonding immediately over a name, their name. If you're feeling awkward at that moment and you don't know how to move forward from there, then just simply ask a question. Questions engage.

Anita Brick: Well, you know, it's interesting. There are a couple of questions related to what if you don't feel comfortable? An alum asked, he said, "When I am nervous, I do my best to look smart and I ask complex questions, which typically doesn't help in making a real connection. What have you seen others do to make it easier to make that personal connection?"

Gloria Petersen: Well, first, don't try to look and sound smart. That is probably the number one rule here. Allow a simple conversation to evolve. Both interested in taking that conversation to a more complex level, they're going to continue. And the others will fade out and that's okay. Don't try too hard to be something at that moment because they will see right through you. Just be natural, be yourself, and sometimes it's not about talking, it's about listening. A trick that I often teach, when you walk up to a group or you feel like you're not engaged in that conversation or you don't know how to, use your eyes, they are so powerful. When somebody is speaking, make eye contact. I don't mean to stare them down, but just make comfortable eye contact. When the conversation changes to somebody else, then take your eye contact over to that person. Because with your eyes, you are engaged and they can see that you're listening. If you feel a need to talk, just ask a question to get yourself engaged into the conversation or paraphrase back what you think they said. Paraphrasing is powerful too, then they know you're listening.

Anita Brick: It's easy to fall into that almost a default. There was another student, actually, it was an alum and alum asked this question, "I've been told it's pretty obvious when I'm feeling insecure. Clearly, that does not inspire people to want to be my advocate. What advice would you have for someone who needs to look confident before they actually are?"

Gloria Petersen: Okay, we're going to start with your posture because you need to look confident and it's a visual thing. When you are feeling insecure, the first thing that goes is your posture and it tends to mimic that insecurity. Another thing you might start doing is fidgeting, which is going to also send a message that you're not comfortable. Facial expressions, biting the lip, all these things are tell-tale signs that you're not feeling comfortable. There's a commercial, love it, because it really says it all. Don't ever let your insecurities show. We're all human, we're going to have those insecurities at different moments. We're going to feel unsure of ourselves. That's just human. But what you want to do is override that with your own body language. And a technique that I often teach, and those who are listening, if you could stand and do this, you'll find how it works, but if you stand and you put your hands behind your back, grab your thumb, straighten up your arms, your shoulders will start to go into kind of an attention mode. Your chin will automatically be parallel to the floor and your posture will be like a puppet that strings been pulled straight up and there's a certain sense of power and confidence that comes with that posture. And then as a child, you play the game freeze. Anita, you probably played it. You freeze, but then you have to let go. Don't change anything. Just let go of that thumb. Let your arms go nicely to your side. Hold the posture and you're going to feel more confident and self-assured as a result of the posturing. You're kind of changing the physics of your body a little bit to give you what you need at that moment. Anita Brick: Now, how does this change? Say, you're not in the same room, you're not on FaceTime or Skype or Webex or whatever, so you can't see the person, how do you convey confidence when the nonverbal cues are invisible?

Gloria Petersen: Anita, you can feel them. When you're talking to somebody on the phone, you can feel slouchy in different kind of posture as opposed to one that is confident. The most important thing is how it makes you feel.

Anita Brick: Totally makes sense. Here are two questions related to feeling like an outsider. The first student said, "I don't really like to share much about myself with people I don't know. And I do understand that this actually gets in the way of connecting for networking purposes. How do you suggest that I could find a middle way?"

Gloria Petersen: It can be tricky and it can be awkward, I'm not going to say otherwise. Just consider this, when a question comes to you that you feel is too personal or it's controversial, whichever it may be, you just don't want to go there, you can simply counter with something saying, "Thank you for asking. However, I prefer to learn more about..." And divert it, but your facial expression's got to be kind, can't be stern or angry. Divert the conversation and let it go in a different direction and it will.

Anita Brick: Okay. So here's someone who feels a little outside of most conversations. This is another student, "Many of the people I meet are really into sports and that's just not me. As a result, I feel like an outsider in many conversations. Do I need to make sports priority or do you have other suggestions on how to be more part of the group?"

Gloria Petersen: It can be about sports, it can be about weather, but people get locked into a conversation on one topic and you don't know where to go, because not your thing. I keep going back to asking a question because questions are a great way to divert something and you can ask a question or you could make a statement, a two informed type of comment that can divert the conversation. It could be something about technology. It could be an app that you recently saw or heard of. Even if it's a sports-related app, you're kind of diverting it into the technology realm. Pay attention to group of people that you're interacting with that's talking sports, but there's going to be one there that's not as interested in the sports language as the others are. And that's the one you're going to be able to divert and maybe sidestep the others in a kind way, in a respectful way and have the conversation that's more meaningful to you. There are many different answers to every scenario that has been presented. Those are just ideas. Anita, what would be yours?

Anita Brick: I learned this from my aunt. Her mentor took her to places and she met people that we would all recognize their names. She was younger, she wasn't poorly educated but she wasn't super well-educated, and her mentor said, "Learn how to ask questions." Because even in the sports area, if you ask a question and you have to of course listen authentically, it can make it easier for the other person to open up because they're very enthusiastic. And it was kind of funny because even though she very rarely, at least in the early days, expressed her own opinion about things, she asked a lot of questions and she became known in this circle of fairly intellectual people in Manhattan as a brilliant conversationalist. She-

Gloria Petersen: Absolutely.

Anita Brick: Yeah, I know, isn't it? It's really funny. This goes into a question that a student said. He said, "I don't actually have a fear around connecting. My challenge is that others tell me I talk too much and I listened too little. Do you have a suggestion for me to become a better listener? Which clearly does not come easily to me."

Gloria Petersen: I can relate to that a big time and-

Anita Brick: Me too.

Gloria Petersen: Trust me, I've gotten way better than I used to be. It's a discipline. People complain about you talking a lot. That's education for you to try to be more mindful and more disciplined and it's not easy. I totally get that. It's not easy, but it's important.

Anita Brick: Well, here's something. I thought this was an interesting question and I can't say that I haven't thought this myself at times. An alum said, "I feel that most networking is fake, forced, and even manipulative. How do I know who the takers are and who the fakers are so I don't waste my time with them?"

Gloria Petersen: I hear that a lot, especially with young people. My first question is where are you networking, where are you going? If you're going to the same places all the time with the same people, there's clicks and maybe you're trying to break through a click or something like that, but not all networking is fake, forced or even manipulative. It's a very important part of doing business, it's a very important part of finding a job lead. Huge values to that, so when somebody feels, with all due respect to this particular individual, that fake, forced, manipulative, I think you've got some issues that you need to address first and then find a way to get comfortable with a networking environment. If that's what's in your mind, it's going to be a barrier to anything they can personally gain or learn. And it's really unfair to those present because they might not be that way. It sounds like he or she's grouping everybody into one group and that is just not the case. Networking has great value. You have to find a way to get comfortable with it to make it work for you and not work against you.

Anita Brick: As someone close to me who's been in the work world for a long time, and he would say that maybe the person who asks this question approaches networking in a fake, forced, or manipulative manner, and that's what they're projecting onto others because that's how they operate.

Gloria Petersen: That is a great point. You're so right because sometimes we pass our own insecurities onto other people.

Anita Brick: Checking at the door how much of it is them and how much of it is us, but I do like your point, if you're going to the same place over and over again and that's your experience, go try something else.

Gloria Petersen: It's all about how you choose to be.

Anita Brick: You're right. You're absolutely right. Switching gears a little bit, there's a student who wanted to understand how to connect by helping others and he said, "I know it's a good idea to help others, I'm just not sure where to start. The people I want to network with know a lot more about the field than I do. Where would you suggest I start to help others? In the past when you've seen people who maybe have less experience or at least less experience in the field that they are entering, how have you seen them add value to their potential advocates to make it worthwhile for both parties?"

Gloria Petersen: Well, one avenue would be to try to bring them together with somebody else that you know that can help them and maybe mention, "I have an introduction I'd like to make for you because I think she can really help you with this particular area," if you feel that you can't. But keeping that communication going by people connector, connect this person to other people.

Anita Brick: It really does go back to helping others, but maybe not feeling like that it all has to come from you. It could come from other people, it could come from other resources. Anything from, in some cases, a TED talk to a book to a white paper.

Gloria Petersen: Oh, absolutely. Or you can just say something simple like, "Let me give that some thought. I think I've got some ideas for you. They're just not coming to me at this moment, but I promise to email you, text you, or call you when I do have something of value to give you because I know it's there. It's just not coming to me at this moment."

Anita Brick: That takes a lot of courage and humility to do that. That would probably be impressive just in and of itself to not try to pretend.

Gloria Petersen: And be helpful. You want to try to keep a connection tangible. You are not going to have everything that's needed at that moment of conversation to have it go to another level or help it make a great connection, but you follow up. The magic of the follow-up.

Anita Brick: I think you're absolutely right. Do you have time for a couple more questions?

Gloria Petersen: Oh, absolutely.

Anita Brick: So alum said, "I know your scope is global in nature, Gloria. Networking and connecting is not done the same across the globe. I am based in Europe and doing more and more work in Asia. Any tips to increase my success greatly appreciated as I am making this move."

Gloria Petersen: Going abroad, like going to Asia, your best resource is a student from that country. I'm…

Anita Brick: Or an alum for that matter, right? Or an alum.

Gloria Petersen: Alum, absolutely. Yeah, an alum. Absolutely. But don't write just on books. Get the real world response and ask the alum, say, "In your country, what is more honorable?" And find out, do some research, and adapt to that style.

Anita Brick: This is an alum who has 20 years of work experience. I find it fascinating that he is asking that question, but going from Europe to Asia, it's not going to be the same. One of my former colleagues said when she was going to call on companies in Asia, I think she called it her 12 cup tea, she would usually have 12 cups of tea with someone and that would be obviously not all in one meeting, but it would be over multiple meetings before they would ever talk about the business at hand because that was the nature of that particular country within Asia. Just to bring things together, and you've given us a lot of tips and ideas and strategies, what are three things you would advise someone who maybe right now has a fear of connecting and would actually like to turn that around into something beneficial? What would you advise someone?

Gloria Petersen: My first one, probably the number one would be the most important aspect of a conversation is that it validates people through the gift of one's attention. Thinking of conversation in those terms might actually make it more meaningful. The other one would be the sincerest compliment you can pay anyone is to be a good listener. When he or she's speaking, listen with your eyes. You'd be surprised how you'll have a conversation with somebody or they're talking to you and your eyes are diverted, they're over their head, they're over to the side. You're looking around the room or in the area to see if there isn't somebody more interesting to talk to, and that is so obvious and it's so rude. Keeping your eye contact on the person who is speaking and making them feel like the most important, whether they're interesting or not, making them feel very, very interesting. I have another one, but it's more about groups.

Anita Brick: Okay, go for it.

Gloria Petersen: How often have you stood in a group and you've noticed not everybody knows each other or maybe you know some and not others, and then you see some people standing in that group or sitting at that table and their eyes are diverting? You have a wonderful opportunity to demonstrate leadership at that moment, no matter how shy, introvert, extrovert, no matter where you fall in that category. I've had this lesson so many times that, boy, I'm so, so on it. When you're sitting at a table, you're in a group and you realize that not everyone does know everyone and take a leadership role, I just point to the ceiling to get everyone's attention. And I say, "Excuse me. I don't think we all know each other, at least I know I don't. Would you mind introducing yourself and maybe saying just something real quick?" I always start with a person on my right. I don't start with me and they will introduce themselves to the group and then your eyes go to the next person to make sure they have the floor. Then your eyes go to the third person to make sure that they are making their introduction. Certainly, there will be interruptions, but you keep your eyes going. When it comes back to you, the beauty is they're wanting to know who are you that you just did this. And a story I'll share with you on that when I made the move from Chicago to Phoenix. I'm in a different culture, different from Chicago. I joined the Phoenix Chamber of Commerce immediately. Tried to get to know the landscape here. I went to an awards' luncheon. I had no clue who everyone at that table was and I did what I just did. Everyone introduced themselves. By the time I said my name, the speaker started. There were two people at that table who connected immediately. Because they didn't know each other, they said, "Hey, I need to talk to you at this meeting." You could see the connection starting. When I got up, one gentleman at the table said, "Ms. Petersen." "Yes?" "Who are you? Been to a lot of groups and business lunches, but no one's ever taken that kind of initiative before. I've got a lead for you and it'll be on your table when you get back to your office." And he did, and it was a great lead. I thought, "Oh, my God, I just do what I preach." So what I'm preaching to you is this works. Take the leadership because right away, I came across as a leader. I wasn't the leader, but I came across with a strong leadership skill.

Anita Brick: I've never heard anyone suggest that before and I think it's brilliant.

Gloria Petersen: It's powerful.

Anita Brick: Powerful.

Gloria Petersen: Especially when you start to see people connecting and you feel like, "Ah, look what I just did. I'm connecting people." Sometimes when you have people at a table in their group, two or three people are clicking, you'll dissolve it.

Anita Brick: The other thing about this is that the fear can easily dissipate because the attention is not on you, you're putting it on everyone else, and that can make the fear at least diminish.

Gloria Petersen: Oh, it does. It's a wonderful feeling when you know that you've helped people connect. A conversation, networking, all these things, they're all about connecting. That's why the umbrella title to my books is The Art of the Professional Connection. It is about making that connection in a very professional and respectful way.

Anita Brick: It's great, very insightful. I think you put a slightly different spin, which added a wonderful dimension, so thank you very much for doing that.

Gloria Petersen: Oh, my pleasure and my honor to be included. Thank you.

Anita Brick: Wonderful, wonderful. Thanks again. And thank you all for listening. This is Anita Brick with CareerCast at Chicago Booth. Keep advancing.